Discussion about grinds

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From the little amount of other mmos I've played (if I'm remembering them correctly cause for some it's been years), only BDO had big grouping of mobs, though even there you had to pull most of them yourself cause only a few would agro right away. FF14 was just a solo experience so barely any social agro at all. B&S was kinda the same. WoW mainly had long agro, but even with mobs from the same type/faction you could still pull singular mobs from a group just by slowly approaching them.

I'm not saying that L2 is end all and be all. It was just the main mmo I've played so I'm literally stating the things I liked from it. The same way a WoW-main would do when describing things they liked in WoW. The things I've stated also were in contrast to the system Azhrae described, which is why I said that I preferred the system I was more familiar with, but ultimately didn't care what Intrepid would go with.

I couldn't give fewer shits if L2 stole all its mechanics or somehow invented them all on the spot. I'm sure that the things people like in EQ came from somewhere too. If I'd played EQ instead of L2 back when I got into mmos, I'd be giving examples from it in just the same way I'm doing with L2. And some other "akshually" person would say that EQ's features were taken from UO or some other shit. Which in turn was inspired by some ancient MUDs which came from D&D which stemmed from fantasy novels which came from irl escapism of some medieval dudes who had a bit too much to drink and got a vivid imagination. And all it started with a big bang HEY

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40. It has had 40 updates in its currently still existing life.

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Every update added content. Some were bigger some were smaller. Did EQ's expansions always add a ton of content? Cause I think I looked its history up once and I don't think I saw thousands of things added in each expansion. L2 came out in 2003 in Korea and has had an update roughly every 6 months (afaik), which leads to 40 updates with some of them being on the smaller size and some literally changing the whole world.

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I prefer L2's all of those when compared to other mmos that I've seen from the period. Though two of these things are highly subjective in the first place (just like most of the things you listed).

And when it comes to graphics, from what I've seen in reviews of L2's release - it had one of the most stunning graphics in an mmo back then. And I definitely know that a lot of people that I played with praised it for looking better than most single player games from that time. This also led to the game only running on better PCs, because you needed the power to run the game well.

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I never really understood that critique (maybe it's smth with my eyes, I dunno) and have never heard it addressed to L2 so I guess I was just playing in a different gaming bubble.

I have an even better suggestion, how about we go back to topic of grind and how we all hate it so much, with some of us not hating it at all. And with me loving it

Good video that describes the ultimate goal of any kind of grind: make the "need" to do smth in the game feel less than the "want" of the reward that the "need" gets you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aqn3Zqe4AaU

If I "want" an uberstrong weapon, I'll "need" to do a lot of stuff. But if I "want" a few mats for my gear repairs, I should "need" to only spend a few minutes. Unless the repairs are for that uberstrong weapon. Then I should "need" to do a fair bit of stuff.