PVP system thoughts

Post by CROW3 on 2022-07-06 21:35:58

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Post by OlympusBurns on 2022-07-06 21:38:15

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Post by Azherae on 2022-07-06 21:40:46

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This is the idea. The goal would be to manipulate the behaviour of people to actually resolve a conflict in ANY way they wish to, without innate and immediate disadvantage.

You see someone running at you, instead of 'having to flag up when they might be friendly', see if they attack you first. If they do, you can stand there and die KNOWING with CERTAINTY that they will be Red. If you want to fight, and they're willing to either 'take only the small advantage from their initial hit' or 'wait for you to heal so you can duel', then you fight, your conflict is resolved.

Or you can 'spend time explaining to the other person that you were just about to leave' or 'are willing to share with them', or any number of other things, without worrying that you will DEFINITELY be dead by the time you do so. And they in turn have more reason to talk it out rather than getting a giant pile of Corruption 'to avoid getting caught off guard'.

Similarly, since the Gauge doesn't convert for a while, if you chase off someone without killing them, you have some time to decide how to handle it.

Etc etc. Long story. Still irrelevant.

Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-06 21:44:19

It keeps coming up so I might as well since I'm in that mood today.

Note, this is mostly for you and as I always always say about it, it does not work in Ashes (which is why I have no problem sharing it because I don't think Intrepid would ever use it and honestly I also don't care if they do).

Imo the correct way to do this is.
1. Combatant attacks Non-Combatant and does damage, a Gauge fills up relative to those two players only. The value of that Gauge applies a percentage reduction to any further damage the Non-Combatant takes, increasing as you get lower, but does NOT affect DoT in exactly the same way.
2. If Non-Combatant changes to Combatant, the Gauge is zeroed and the two can battle 'fairly'. This allows a player to treat an initial hit as a challenge not a panic moment. If Non-Combatant agrees to flag up and fight for the position, they can heal first. If Combatant is not okay with them healing first, they keep attacking.
3. Every time Non-Combatant heals themselves or is healed, the Gauge is reduced. You can run, stall, or negotiate, but that's it.
4. Combatant can continue all the way to killing Non-Combatant at which point the Gauge converts into Corruption. If anything ELSE kills the Non-Combatant, same deal. The Gauge increase is pretty exponential as health gets lower, mind you, so it's a LOT of potential Corruption to kill even one person. Multiply even higher for level gap situations.
5. After a certain period of TIME, the Gauge also becomes Corruption whether you kill the target or not. So just 'raw griefing' will eventually corrupt you, but pinging people probably doesn't give much.

There's a bunch of other stuff related to this Gauge and the Corruption in the system I have that makes it harder to steal bosses from people without a fairISH fight.

None of this is what Ashes wants, but when you notice that I kinda 'dismiss' other options, it's because I've ran some scenarios and I only put effort into thinking about stuff that has an effect that I personally consider better than the above.

This does not fit Ashes. There's no reason for anyone to care about it, but similarly, I don't care about Ashes' system and plan to just ignore it, other than the obvious unavoidable consequence of 'dying while Red' that I will just consider part of the game.
Does the healing reduce the gauge exponentially too? If I were to bring a dude to half health and then heal him back up, would I have reduced the gauge completely or would there be some overflow? I'm assuming it'd be overflow, right?

But then what about just hitting and healing as a means of harassment. Your first hit doesn't give as much gauge so the heal should reduce it completely, if I understood this correctly. Could the gauge have a hit-relative-to-hplost weight to it too? This could also positively effect differently-geared people.

Post by Azherae on 2022-07-06 21:51:07

It keeps coming up so I might as well since I'm in that mood today.

Note, this is mostly for you and as I always always say about it, it does not work in Ashes (which is why I have no problem sharing it because I don't think Intrepid would ever use it and honestly I also don't care if they do).

Imo the correct way to do this is.
1. Combatant attacks Non-Combatant and does damage, a Gauge fills up relative to those two players only. The value of that Gauge applies a percentage reduction to any further damage the Non-Combatant takes, increasing as you get lower, but does NOT affect DoT in exactly the same way.
2. If Non-Combatant changes to Combatant, the Gauge is zeroed and the two can battle 'fairly'. This allows a player to treat an initial hit as a challenge not a panic moment. If Non-Combatant agrees to flag up and fight for the position, they can heal first. If Combatant is not okay with them healing first, they keep attacking.
3. Every time Non-Combatant heals themselves or is healed, the Gauge is reduced. You can run, stall, or negotiate, but that's it.
4. Combatant can continue all the way to killing Non-Combatant at which point the Gauge converts into Corruption. If anything ELSE kills the Non-Combatant, same deal. The Gauge increase is pretty exponential as health gets lower, mind you, so it's a LOT of potential Corruption to kill even one person. Multiply even higher for level gap situations.
5. After a certain period of TIME, the Gauge also becomes Corruption whether you kill the target or not. So just 'raw griefing' will eventually corrupt you, but pinging people probably doesn't give much.

There's a bunch of other stuff related to this Gauge and the Corruption in the system I have that makes it harder to steal bosses from people without a fairISH fight.

None of this is what Ashes wants, but when you notice that I kinda 'dismiss' other options, it's because I've ran some scenarios and I only put effort into thinking about stuff that has an effect that I personally consider better than the above.

This does not fit Ashes. There's no reason for anyone to care about it, but similarly, I don't care about Ashes' system and plan to just ignore it, other than the obvious unavoidable consequence of 'dying while Red' that I will just consider part of the game.
Does the healing reduce the gauge exponentially too? If I were to bring a dude to half health and then heal him back up, would I have reduced the gauge completely or would there be some overflow? I'm assuming it'd be overflow, right?

But then what about just hitting and healing as a means of harassment. Your first hit doesn't give as much gauge so the heal should reduce it completely, if I understood this correctly. Could the gauge have a hit-relative-to-hplost weight to it too? This could also positively effect differently-geared people.

This is also a requirement, yes.

Because again, remember that my goal in design is to create a PvP community.

So 'attacking someone right after a fight when they are at 30% HP' should be discouraged unless you have a very real reason you want that person dead and feel you can't beat them in a fair fight.

So if you hit someone for 10% of their HP when they were at 100%, they end up at 90%, you get 11 Dv.

You hit someone for 10% of their HP when they are at 50%, they end up at 40%, you get like 96 Dv.

It's meant to create a massive difference in situation.

You as a level 40 hit a level 20 for 100% of their HP from full? I'm seriously willing to give you 4,000 Dv. (level difference x 100% damage x 1+((100-amount of health they were at)/100) )

This applies to everyone in the attack group who actually strikes. There's other rules for 'how much Dv you absorb by healing someone with Dv'.

EDIT: Healing by the player under attack does not have exponential results in the same way, so they can in fact heal themselves a few times and you the attacker still end up with lots of Dv. But like I said, this is the simplified BASE of a really complex design I have which is not really worth discussing here.

Post by CROW3 on 2022-07-06 21:53:49

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Post by Azherae on 2022-07-06 21:55:04

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My intention would be to overall increase levels of violence and conflict.

Post by CROW3 on 2022-07-06 21:56:41

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Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-06 22:12:20

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Yeah, you just increase the volume on the victim's side and unless they fight back - it keeps increasing :D

Post by Azraya on 2022-07-06 22:45:56

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Post by Dygz on 2022-07-06 23:23:12

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Post by Azraya on 2022-07-06 23:30:16

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Post by Dygz on 2022-07-06 23:47:58

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Post by Azraya on 2022-07-06 23:55:22

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Post by Dygz on 2022-07-06 23:58:18

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Post by Azraya on 2022-07-07 00:01:56

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Post by Dolyem on 2022-07-07 00:17:57

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Post by Azraya on 2022-07-07 00:24:04

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Post by Dolyem on 2022-07-07 00:30:38

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Post by Azraya on 2022-07-07 00:34:09

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Post by Dolyem on 2022-07-07 00:50:21

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Post by PenguinPaladin on 2022-07-08 01:25:50

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Post by Dolyem on 2022-07-08 06:56:12

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Post by Alienicon on 2022-07-31 22:12:42

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Post by Mag7spy on 2022-07-31 22:18:54

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Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-31 22:19:25

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No pve servers and no way to 100% avoid being ganked. Sooner or later there will be a dude who'll want to kill someone and you will just so happen to be next to him.

And even if that never happens, there'll still be node wars, node sieges or caravan attacks - all of which would directly influence your gameplay, mainly in the way of you getting killed and your stuff getting destroyed/taken.

Post by Azherae on 2022-07-31 22:20:30

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As of now, there is no way to do this as a 'normal' or possibly 'significant' gameplay option.

Post by Asgerr on 2022-07-31 22:23:08

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Post by Azherae on 2022-07-31 22:34:08

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Also you should add on average about 1 day for every X deaths to the leveling process.

We don't know exactly what X is, yet, but we have:

Experience debt will scale to approximately 2 or 3 percent of the total XP for a max level player. These numbers are subject to change based on testing. [23]

Post by Alienicon on 2022-07-31 22:42:22

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