Another area perma flagged for PVP?

We have not received permission from Glir to share the quoted post.

Guess we had different experiences with the game then.

We have not received permission from Abarat to share the quoted post.

He hasn't made up his mind about what PVP will feel like. He has made up his mind about when Steven has told us PVP will happen. He's never said anything negative about what PVP combat will feel like, only about the incentive structure that determines when it will happen.

The other important point to note is that he did not invest in the thing that Ashes has recently changed into. The thing he invested in is the Ashes that he was explicitly told would not be this way . (Whether his interpretation was correct or not is not relevant.) Then he was told that it's no longer the thing he invested in. (Whether his original interpretation was correct is still not relevant.) He can't get his money (or time) back now, but he would never have invested at all in the thing that Ashes currently is. In short: He didn't invest in the thing he's rejecting. He invested in something that was (from his perspective) replaced by the thing he's rejecting.

At this point of course, he has already invested. He might as well stick around and represent his demographic: People who would have played "the Ashes that appeared to be promised until just recently" but who will probably not play the Ashes that is currently promised. If Steven didn't want him (and the class of player he represents) here, he should have been clearer up front. Overall though? Even though his presence may upset some people, nothing about Dygz's behavior is inconsistent.

The main point is that Open Seas PvP is a deal-breaker for him in terms of making a new investment: the long-term commitment of the hours and years involved in progressing in the final game. He might as well stick around and enjoy the Alphas and Betas he's already bought in to. It's not like he hates the rest of the game, and without his prior investment in it as a long-term commitment, it's easier to brush off the feeling "this game sucks long-term" and enjoy what's left.

We have not received permission from Abarat to share the quoted post.

There are a LOT of other PvP worlds people have lived in. "What various types of them feel like" isn't really news... Ashes of Creation went from one somewhat novel type, to an old, well known one.

People do already have some experience with the "Open Seas" style, and with the type of community that comes with it.

We have not received permission from Abarat to share the quoted post.

If he ever does (which I doubt), he would probably do it by saying "I've had [this] experience, and it changed my perspective because...".

I certainly hope we don't fault people for changing their opinions when they learn new things or have new experiences. What a world that would be.

We have not received permission from DarkTides to share the quoted post.

Indeed it does, and that's the game Dygz invested in. He didn't invest in a non-PvP game. He invested in a game with "player corruption as a means to prevent the game from becoming a murder box". He put a lot of effort into verifying this, too. He was told there would be PvP events and objectives like sieges and caravans, but otherwise there would in fact be "player corruption as a means to prevent the game from becoming a murder box".

Ashes of Creation today is a game where "player corruption as a means to prevent the game from becoming a murder box" exists only in certain regions, even if those regions are the majority.

Not everyone cares about that difference, but you can't deny it's real.

We have not received permission from DarkTides to share the quoted post.

See, this MIGHT be a bad take.

Because this happens when you go 'this person who has this opinion can't possibly have had the same experiences/seek the same experiences as I do'.

Except it would be VERY difficult for me to PvP more. In MMOs perhaps, but given that nearly 80% of my time gaming is spent in PvP games and some of those are also 'matchmaking-less' MMOs (by the definitions of some, MMOFPS I guess), I'm not giving up the other 20%, I don't think.

Every 'you guys are worried over nothing' post makes me less confident that this is going to work. Because I LIKE it here, I LIKE what AoC is, and that response still makes me want to ditch it because it just indicates that those who believe it will have NO real answers (or concern for others) if it fails.

Are we going to go around claiming now that 'Ashes was always even more PvP and then got toned down'? Or are we talking about Lineage and claiming that Ashes is 'Lineage toned down'?

We have too many Lineage veterans around here to get away with that, I hope.

We have not received permission from Strevi to share the quoted post.

Yes, Dygz has said this before, and I am as usual butting in to back Dygz up on this.

Moreso that a Dev-Designed boss has a LIMIT, and a SYSTEM backing up that limit. PvP players do not have this, especially not in a non-Objective based PvP situation.

In a Siege if you lose to players, you lost to 'the number of players the game allowed to join the Siege'.

At sea, if you lose to players, there was no limit on that number. You could lose to 'One tank and 3000 mages spamming their basic wand attack'. I'm not arguing if this is fair or not, don't care. But it IS very different and for some, not enjoyable. Some PvP players don't even like this 'no-holds-barred' PvP.