Unable To CC NonCombatants?! What Does It All Mean?!

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Any amount of corruption allows a player to drop equipped gear upon death. The higher the corruption the greater the chances. [66] – Steven Sharif

(this is a semi-recent change)

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I mean, if you're doing several PKs in a row, you gonna have yourself 30+ minutes of grinding, even if any given single kill would've only given you 5-10 mins of corruption.

It's just that when I look back at L2, people were usually in the high dozens of PKs even when they PKed rarely. And they'd go do the counter cleansing quest if they started feeling that the karma timer was getting a bit too high each time they PKed. And I feel like ~15 kills should be a good number before you'd "have to" do the quest.

Depending on different situations, that'd potentially be maybe 1-2 weeks of gameplay with a PK here and there.

But again, that kind of balance only works if the time to grind off is somewhat short. If it's way longer than L2's, as Steven said, then my whole suggestion is pointless by default.

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Not to victim blame or anything, but imo in an owpvp game you gotta be aware of your surroundings. Especially if you're in a lucrative location. But yes, the victim will have the CC upper hand so it'll balance out the first strike. And I agree with all the other points.

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He alleged that he's played L2 for thousands of hours. And while I do agree with him on the "times have changed so the system gotta change too" point, I do think that Steven has already addressed that change in his design. It just needs to be properly balanced now.

NiKr wrote: »

But again, that kind of balance only works if the time to grind off is somewhat short. If it's way longer than L2's, as Steven said, then my whole suggestion is pointless by default.

So for clarity, if you had to GUESS the amount of time needed to work it off based on 'longer than L2', what are we looking at here? Asking for multiple friends.

Azherae wrote: »

So for clarity, if you had to GUESS the amount of time needed to work it off based on 'longer than L2', what are we looking at here? Asking for multiple friends.

I'd prooooobably go with a ~30min for your first PK? Maybe 20, but the "significantly longer" wording from Steven kinda implies that it is in fact way longer. And if I'm remembering correctly, a solo location would give you enough XP at peak farming pace to remove one kill worth of karma in 2-3 mins (I thiiiink?). Party locations would usually mean just x6-8hp mobs which gave roughly the same amount of XP per group member that was then boosted by the group XP bonus, so if your pace was similar you'd clear it a bit faster.

I thiiink that's about right. But for the hell of it I'll go download the first private server I find and just double check, for both my sake and your data. I'll ping you when I'm done.

@Azherae so I checked a somewhat old version, so in theory this should be close to what Steven has in mind when he compares his values to AoC's. A PK gives you 240 karma (this is by a lvl5 char of a lvl3 char). ~300 XP removes one point. The very first mob in the game gives you 30xp.

An interesting fact that I never noticed before, you gotta get ~300XP in one kill to remove the point. I tried killing 10 first mobs but the point didn't go away (killed around 20 and still nothing).

I'll go check a much later update and at higher lvls to make sure that the scaling doesn't change.

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L2 was balanced around party gameplay too, so barely any classes had self-healing, let alone powerful one. So pvp was usually a race of dps. And depending on your buffs and class matchup (and gear difference), ttk could go from a minute or two to pure seconds. And in terms of CCs, in general only bards had roots, only a few classes had silences (mainly mages), quite a few classes had slows and quite a few fighter classes had stuns of some sort (that is the target couldn't do anything while stunned).

If you were in a situation where ttk was closer to seconds than minutes - the stun was your only chance to win out against a fast attacker who shot first. Also, due to different resistances quite a few CCs had lowish chances of even proccing, so most fights either came down to dps or to luck with a powerful CC.

NiKr wrote: »

Azherae so I checked a somewhat old version, so in theory this should be close to what Steven has in mind when he compares his values to AoC's. A PK gives you 240 karma (this is by a lvl5 char of a lvl3 char). ~300 XP removes one point. The very first mob in the game gives you 30xp.

An interesting fact that I never noticed before, you gotta get ~300XP in one kill to remove the point. I tried killing 10 first mobs but the point didn't go away (killed around 20 and still nothing).

I'll go check a much later update and at higher lvls to make sure that the scaling doesn't change.

Checked a later update. Had to go to a high rate server to check high lvl chars so the math is not quite exact, but still.

The karma gain was the same, 240. Btw, after 4 kills it doubled to 480 per kill. At max lvl 117kXP removed 1 point of karma. That 117kXP is ~0.001% of a lvl. And to get that amount of XP I had to go kill 51lvl mobs while I was 85lvl.

Ok, checked a mid rate server too (at low lvls) and now the points get removed at around 9kXP (lvl %-wise that value is all over the place so it seems to be more about XP gained than purely your char's relative lvl).

In other words, the higher your lvl the easier it is to remove karma, so it seems that my initial approximation about the timings was somewhat correct. And the "significantly longer" time would most likely be quite a bit over 10min.