10-15 SECONDS TTK

I wonder what the ttk on a duo vs a summon looks like....

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Yes, we did, but like I said raid situations were way rarer than group vs group situations. So hearing Steven say "when it comes to groups..." - I think about group pvp, not raid pvp.

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Well, "revive is cheaper than a heal"

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Rogue has full stealth and warrior jumps a god damn mile and potentially from a higher point as well.

So just as you asked me about the name macros, I gotta ask you: don't tell me your party never had a dagger who'd try to backstab a bishop out of stealth before the fight even started

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I'm talking about war/siege situations, cause PKing situations are a whole different thing.

We don't know what kind of anti-stealth AoC will have yet. L2 only really had it on Archers and even then they had to spam it constantly to protect their healers. Spamming aoes on mages would've burned through their mana needlessly.

Also, we obviously don't know if Rogues will even benefit from backstabbing or hits from stealth. I assume they will, cause that's just logical for a rogue, but it's still not a 100% feature.

And like I said, if I'm wrong - cool, great, I hope I am. But right now I don't really see that being the case, judging by all the things Steven has said.

NiKr wrote: »

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Yes, we did, but like I said raid situations were way rarer than group vs group situations. So hearing Steven say "when it comes to groups..." - I think about group pvp, not raid pvp.

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Well, "revive is cheaper than a heal"

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Rogue has full stealth and warrior jumps a god damn mile and potentially from a higher point as well.

So just as you asked me about the name macros, I gotta ask you: don't tell me your party never had a dagger who'd try to backstab a bishop out of stealth before the fight even started

This brings up a question since L2 is apparently our basis...

Is Backstab a guaranteed hit in L2? All quicksearches indicate that it can just miss, but as always I ask the veterans.

Azherae wrote: »

Is Backstab a guaranteed hit in L2? All quicksearches indicate that it can just miss, but as always I ask the veterans.

If you're hitting in the back - it's 100% (unless the target has a buff that dodges any phys ability or reflects it back). If it's to the side - there's a chance to miss iirc. If it's to the front - it doesn't work.

There's the explicit ability "Backstab", but all dagger (it was a class type) ability have a higher chance of hitting the target if you hit them to their back.

And then different classes had different chances on their frontal/side hits, counterbalanced by other stats.

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Then any kill I do in the future will be a 225h+++ ttk, cause I was training my character his entire life for that kill

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Considering how big the world will be, I don't really see how the defenders are supposed to scout all of it in hopes of finding a needle in a haystack.

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Was SWTOR a solo mmo or did it heavily rely on party gameplay?

Cause my desire for a longer ttk comes directly from Ashes claiming to be a party game. If the ttk is super short even in 1v1 - party gameplay will be utter trash, because it's gonna be way easier to wipe your enemy (or for them to wipe you), and that's not even considering even a slightest advantage in character/build power.

I understand when people dislike long 1v1s (though I still think it's a fault of the combat design, rather than the ttk itself), but I'm gonna be reaaaal curious to watch people die in mere seconds in a group vs group encounter and then complain that they couldn't even get off a single skill of theirs.

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Yeah this is the part that makes me question some of the reasonings people give.

If it is supposed to be a party game, we would want it balanced around parties.

And even if we then considered 'well it would make 1v1 long and drawn out', if your 1v1 arena is 80% 'waiting for the next round to start' and 20% 'actual fighting, is this better? Who exactly is 'getting bored' watching a longer 1v1 Arena duel, that bothered to watch in the first place?

I don't care as much about the TTK part of this yet, but I don't feel 'this should be fast or 1v1 will be a slog' is a particularly 'fitting' argument for what this game is claimed to be.

Azherae wrote: »

And even if we then considered 'well it would make 1v1 long and drawn out', if your 1v1 arena is 80% 'waiting for the next round to start' and 20% 'actual fighting, is this better? Who exactly is 'getting bored' watching a longer 1v1 Arena duel, that bothered to watch in the first place?

Also, in L2 the funnest arena fights to watch were the ones that went on for 1-2 minutes, instead of one-sided oneshots.

Different strats, different counter plays, different range of knowledge of your opponent's style of play, different class matchups - all played a huge roll exactly because you couldn't just wipe your enemy in a few abilities.

It's really interesting to see people complain about "boring long fights". I really feel like it simply comes from a place of shitty combat design, rather than long ttk.

This was one of the most OP classes in the game at the time and this is the top player of that class (in top OEd gear and with great skill), against people of several different progress lvls (only a few near to the MC), and even then ttk is somewhere around 6-7s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQ9QDoi61hY
And this was during the times when mages/archers could 1-2crit you in a party situation, let alone any assist-kills by a party. If Ashes has even deeper/better combat - I'd definitely want an at least slightly longer ttk.

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To me that's no different than saying that ttk takes longer than the direct process of dmg application to a target

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And attackers would just hide a bit further away from the path, while having either an alt or a friend tracking the caravan's movements.

What I'm trying to say is that the jump shown in the stream wasn't all that difficult to set up and would've been somewhat difficult to repel, especially considering that proper attackers wouldn't be as conspicuous as Steven's group was.

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To me this just sounds like a bad combat design. Either a low amount of abilities and counters to them or a low variety of general counterplay available to players at any given time.

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Again, you just described a bad combat design I dunno what else I can say, except for "I hope we don't get that kind of shit in Ashes".

If we do - yes, you will be correct and it'll all be dumb boring rotations.