Post by Azherae on 2021-05-20 07:19:43
This post is merely a hybridized compilation of what the posters so far have said. Nothing following here specifically is intended to represent my own opinions, only 'the current most likely outcome of a system that probably threads the needle for all considerations above'.
Any poster above that feels I have misunderstood or misrepresented their wish in this compilation, please make a note of it so I can correct it if I continue to do this.
Combat Core:
Step 1: Make two (or three) versions of the Q attack, one like the one we have now (which can be split into one like the current that doesn't move you forward, just Q, and one that moves you forward, W+Q), and another that is the 'sideways' version of the attack, that slides slightly to either side while attacking.
Reasoning: Allows for mobility but not as much issues with ping or lag. The attacker can evade frontal abilities with good timing, do damage while circling an enemy, etc. The defender has enough time to turn to use their own Q to chase, guess the 'same side', or use an ability, while knowing relatively quickly what the position of the opponent will be, based on the movement distance.
Step 2: Give a 'Brace' option that blocks the CC effects of physical, and beam/conal magical attacks and possibly some percentage of the damage from frontal attacks of all kinds. The attacker can then spec into 'Overwhelm' on abilities to get a chance of applying the CC or some additional portion of damage anyway. Player cannot attack or move, outside of ability usage, while Braced.
Reasoning: As Ashes is balanced around small group combat anyway, and a bracing player can be outmaneuvered (especially if it takes a while to cancel out of it), the player can 'decide to brace' when they know a very obvious CC is coming, but the enemy gets to feint and be mobile, or use an ability that isn't a CC but has a longer cast which they normally wouldn't 'get away with'. Monsters and bosses can then be given some amount of natural Overwhelm on various abilities, putting the 'random factor' of CC resists and so on, on the side of the attacker spec.
Step 3: Give the Q attack a tiny stamina cost, one that is tuned to be only a very tiny amount lower than the natural regeneration of stamina over time (this value should not be changeable by any gear). Abilities have larger stamina costs (even if they cost Mana). The result would be that large abilities, Brace, and similar, use up stamina until you drop to a threshold where you can't use these if you keep doing them and spamming Q also, but if you simply stop using your Q attack, it regenerates quite quickly and you can just use abilities again.
Reasoning: Some players and classes will spec into strengthening Q and movement, others can ignore Q altogether, or just use it opportunistically when they are using abilities that also have very low stamina costs, e.g. a mage whose AoE kills a whole group of mobs and the one in front of them has only a sliver, just hit it with a wand blast.
This is currently the absolute simplest distillation I can manage for all the above points. This is not intended to be 'interesting', it is not 'clearly balanced'. This is intended as a concept of 'minimum viable function' that players that have posted so far in the thread might be able to agree on, that could be implemented without nightmarish problems from the dev side.
So yes, previous posters, please shred this for whatever in it has misrepresented anything you said.
New posters, there's not a lot of point in addressing this specific post, better to just give your ideas instead (or disagree with the specifics from the previous posters) and I'll probably get around to doing an expanded version tomorrow to make all the inevitable corrections.
Any poster above that feels I have misunderstood or misrepresented their wish in this compilation, please make a note of it so I can correct it if I continue to do this.
Combat Core:
Step 1: Make two (or three) versions of the Q attack, one like the one we have now (which can be split into one like the current that doesn't move you forward, just Q, and one that moves you forward, W+Q), and another that is the 'sideways' version of the attack, that slides slightly to either side while attacking.
Reasoning: Allows for mobility but not as much issues with ping or lag. The attacker can evade frontal abilities with good timing, do damage while circling an enemy, etc. The defender has enough time to turn to use their own Q to chase, guess the 'same side', or use an ability, while knowing relatively quickly what the position of the opponent will be, based on the movement distance.
Step 2: Give a 'Brace' option that blocks the CC effects of physical, and beam/conal magical attacks and possibly some percentage of the damage from frontal attacks of all kinds. The attacker can then spec into 'Overwhelm' on abilities to get a chance of applying the CC or some additional portion of damage anyway. Player cannot attack or move, outside of ability usage, while Braced.
Reasoning: As Ashes is balanced around small group combat anyway, and a bracing player can be outmaneuvered (especially if it takes a while to cancel out of it), the player can 'decide to brace' when they know a very obvious CC is coming, but the enemy gets to feint and be mobile, or use an ability that isn't a CC but has a longer cast which they normally wouldn't 'get away with'. Monsters and bosses can then be given some amount of natural Overwhelm on various abilities, putting the 'random factor' of CC resists and so on, on the side of the attacker spec.
Step 3: Give the Q attack a tiny stamina cost, one that is tuned to be only a very tiny amount lower than the natural regeneration of stamina over time (this value should not be changeable by any gear). Abilities have larger stamina costs (even if they cost Mana). The result would be that large abilities, Brace, and similar, use up stamina until you drop to a threshold where you can't use these if you keep doing them and spamming Q also, but if you simply stop using your Q attack, it regenerates quite quickly and you can just use abilities again.
Reasoning: Some players and classes will spec into strengthening Q and movement, others can ignore Q altogether, or just use it opportunistically when they are using abilities that also have very low stamina costs, e.g. a mage whose AoE kills a whole group of mobs and the one in front of them has only a sliver, just hit it with a wand blast.
This is currently the absolute simplest distillation I can manage for all the above points. This is not intended to be 'interesting', it is not 'clearly balanced'. This is intended as a concept of 'minimum viable function' that players that have posted so far in the thread might be able to agree on, that could be implemented without nightmarish problems from the dev side.
So yes, previous posters, please shred this for whatever in it has misrepresented anything you said.
New posters, there's not a lot of point in addressing this specific post, better to just give your ideas instead (or disagree with the specifics from the previous posters) and I'll probably get around to doing an expanded version tomorrow to make all the inevitable corrections.