We need PVE servers here's why

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Sometimes speaking with your words changes people's opinions and you don't have to get to the more drastic point of speaking with your wallet and watching something fail.

Not at all saying that's what would happen here. Just reminding you that not everyone goes 'I'll just not buy it', regardless of how justified 'ordering a pizza at a Subway' is.

Sometimes the result is that Subway starts serving pizza.

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I'm sure there will come a point where Ashes will see a huge dropoff in interest even from diehard fans. The reason is because there are at least seven still-undefined aspects of their design that are polarizing.

Basically, we're still at the stage where people have seen so little of the overall development that they hear 'we are open to feedback' and think 'well maybe they'll realize that X is a mistake if I tell them so'. Even for something as relatively extreme as 'Add PvE servers', some people won't think of it as extreme.

If Steven had strong immutable stances on those undefined aspects, we would probably get more specific answers on things. So that's the parallel. To most people, this isn't 'A Subway', but it also is 'just a corner sandwich shop with a billboard up and a few pics of its signature sandwiches, many of which are contradictory'. Or should I say 'oddly inclusive'.

The greatest restaurant (imo of course) near where I live has 'Pizza' in its name but sells shawarma wraps and rice bowls for some reason. It's great. I bet I could ask them to try their hand at some food I haven't thought of yet (because they serve pretty much everything I like anyway).

But they also have nuts in their brownies lately for some reason... and I often eat with someone who has a nut allergy and can't risk it. So I could ask them to stop getting brownies with nuts in them, or I could stop buying their food for safety.

Nuts in brownies are a very polarizing topic. Perhaps they add soul.

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Which would turn the game into NW and we all saw how that looked like.

NiKr wrote: »

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Which would turn the game into NW and we all saw how that looked like.

Did we though? Cause New World sucked for so many other reasons we can't be sure of that.

Azherae wrote: »

Did we though? Cause New World sucked for so many other reasons we can't be sure of that.

The only thing I'm sure of is that we didn't see how it would've been in its original state. Well, alpha testers saw it and apparently cried so much that they changed it? Do we have any NW early testers that can provide an example of how it worked back then? Or was the difference in the overall design so huge that they're incomparable?

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You didn't get it, and you've gone beyond just 'disagreeing'.

So I'll finish the analogy. Assume that the brownies contain both nuts, and some other less 'dangerous' crunchy textured addition.

"Why are there nuts in your brownies, I don't like/can't eat those."
"It's part of the texture, we don't consider them to be as good without them."
"Can you make a version without nuts?"
"Sorry, the texture's required or they don't even bake properly."
"But they already have 'other crunchy thing' anyway, I just want it without the nuts."

You can disagree on whether or not the brownies need the nuts, but for a lot of people, brownies are fine without nuts, and if the point is the texture, and they'll eat it with the other texture (the multiple other PvP), to them, you're just refusing to remove the nuts on principle.

So they ask.

The only thing I understood from the last several comments is that most of yall a hungry. Go eat something!

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So basically you decided the other person was wrong and then explicitly acted as if you didn't understand them. Not even that you didn't understand 'why they had the perception' so you could correct it... just 'outright not meaning it'.

This sounds to me like you're much more likely to be the one not understanding.

If Ashes retained Caravan PvP, Node PvP, Siege PvP, Guild v Guild PvP, Arena PvP, and then changed a few things about people's expectations of bosses, then they still have a heavy PvP game that just doesn't contain pure owPvP.

To some people, who want or don't mind those five forms of PvP but don't want 'random owPvP', this sounds like a good product. It's also one you can't currently get at the implied quality anywhere else. So in short, you're conflating 'I would like this specific form of PvP removed' with 'I should be willing to play other less good games without any of the other forms of PvP I might eventually like because the designers of this game are adamant about keeping the last kind that I don't like'.

Anyways, since you've clarified now that you actually don't have a lack of understanding, just 'prefer to dismiss other people's perspectives if you have a way to just not engage', then at least say that, because there are other people with genuine lack of understanding, so people try to engage you as if you are one of those people.

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Yeah ok, your stance is clear, thanks.

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Then, honestly, speaking from a design standpoint if possible.

Tell me what removing owPvP, just the 'random' kind, affects, in terms of systems. I am not even going to claim there are none, and I'll remind you one more time that I am much closer to a 'griefer' than someone who wants PvP removed from games.

What systems, what balance, what progression, have we ever seen, that we know 'if owPvP is removed, this will start to fail'. I know one. Gathering. It would probably need a rework to not end up like New World's nonsense. To me, that's enough.

But to the standard non-PvP gatherer, they don't even get this benefit, because the person 'who dares to steal their stuff instead of coming to an agreement' in owPvP is probably not a person they can kill . If it's me, I don't even care if they can do it, I'll 'steal their gathering point' anyway. If they retaliate I get a 'match', if they don't I get the item.

So.

What if anything do we know about Ashes that requires owPvP to exist given that there are no Factions and that Guild v Guild exists?