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Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-22 03:32:34
How would you feel if this worked offline as well? As in, you don't need to log into the game, but your character would still run towards the family summoner. This would put even more responsibility on the summoner, because now the summoned char can't fight back (though most likely they wouldn't be able to do that either way, cause the summoned player would most likely be afk), but this would serve a very similar service as the TP summon. As I see it, the family TP is meant to completely cut out the time required to move from ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-22 03:39:33
If I knew that the 90% got their "thing" within just a few tries and spent, say, 1 week to get it, while I was on my 20th try and already spent several months on it - yeah, this would probably feel really unfair. But if the scale difference was lower (as the 11th try example you gave, with only half of people having it), I'd assume I'd be fine with going twice the distance. Though I'm purely guessing here, cause I'm used to this kind of rng system being applied to gear OE and that is the most ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-22 03:44:12
If that person can outfarm your spot - imo they deserve it more than you. And if you can't bring them down accurately enough for mobs to finish them off - they definitely deserve it more than you. That's why there's the GW system. Declare a war on the guild that's most likely to do this and you can pvp them all you want. And if Intrepid keeps the L2's "one-sided war" part of the system (I don't think they are, but still) - that guild's reputation will be in the shitter, same as it was in L2. If ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-22 08:19:59
How though? What if Intrepid's tracker doesn't have some functionality and Intrepid refuses to add it. Wouldn't some 3rd party just make their own and the same hardcore players that care about trackers would just use the better one? Or just even the basic "I wanna use the info outside of the game" wish from players would only be addressed by a 3rd party tracker that's outside of the game. Or would you demand Intrepid make their tracker a separate app?
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-22 09:09:30
You'd be fine with a minimal functionality tracker, but how many others would be? And how many of those people would choose a tracker with a much better functionality, if presented with one by a 3rd party? I'd also assume that some people might not have the same definition of "basic functionality" as you, so there's that too. This is why I think that combat log should be the base lvl of knowledge for people rather than a tracker function/app based on said log. You could add "tracker functionality" to the log (though mainly I'm talking about export of ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-22 09:43:40
And this is where I'd love to give an example of some feature that Intrepid might not want to include, but I got 0 fucking clue what ACT even does
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-22 10:32:57
I guess that's the main problem with trackers for me. I got 0 interest in games that use them (this is the list from act's site) And I got barely any interest of tinkering with or figuring them out in a game that I got 0 interest in. I might ask you or Azherae for a tracker during alpha2 just to see what they provide for the game's experience, but before that I'm not sure I'd be able to give them a fair look through if I tried using them in another game. Is there maybe a video guide ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-22 11:25:47
I wrote this in another thread, but it still applies here The mmos die because they went down the shitter with their design. And you just need to look at FF14's success to see that. FF14 became better at what it was doing over the years and has millions of people playing it and enjoying it. All you need is a good game and people will play it even if they only have 1h a day to play, while the game want you to spend hundreds of hours to achieve smth.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-22 12:03:47
I mean, to me this just looks like a written form of an omniscient pov of the fight. I'm definitely naïve when it comes to this (and obviously haven't experienced content that ever required this), but to me this looks just like a tool to overcome the "humanity" of the game. This puts all the burden of figuring out raid members' fails and misses on the main parser of the tracker (or the group that does it), while also giving that person omniscient powers over the encounter's history. You remove any human factor from it, mainly because you're seeing ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-22 13:08:36
The beauty of pvp is that it doesn't really need expansions. I've seen L2 servers live for years with the same content, but it wasn't an issue because people just pvped with each other for castles and for the super rare loot that this content had. And if you keep adding pve stuff for the players who don't find pvp fun - you'll have yourself a game with high longevity.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-22 14:30:38
I'm not sure that point agrees with me I like, and maybe even prefer, rng in games. I see them as a good equalizer of people, cause I've seen a ton of "rich" people keep throwing resources at rng and failing, while a lucky poor person threw way less money and succeeded. Obviously the overall stats are still a bit skewed towards the rich folk, but that's always the case. At least with rng, the poor have some chance to catch up. And I don't think that the approach of "everyone gets everything" would seem all that interesting to ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-22 14:32:41
Oh, we're at a new stage of necroposting now we're necroing the "tab vs action" thread in another thread!
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-22 14:57:56
It's about "fairness". A person who has more time to earn resources in the game will always be stronger than those who don't have that time. But rng brings the average representative of both sides closer to each other. Yes, there'll always be extremes where a poor person was super unlucky while the rich dude had all the luck he might've wanted, but such extreme situations are still better, imo, than the absolute crater of a gap between the rich and the poor. In my experience, this stuff even helped out curb some of p2w on private servers.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-22 15:03:55
I either missed some context or am just too sleepy to properly string together the messages that led to this comment. And in case you were just saying this as a new topic starter, yes, I agree that mmos have fucked themselves over by trying to appeal to the broadest audience. And the more they tried to do that, the faster the snowball rolled down the mountain, and now we have morpg that are barely even "m" at this point because the people that the patryfinder gives you don't even talk. But because people now see mmos in this ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-22 15:27:48
What if the "risk vs reward" was in the mutually exclusive nature of making the choice between "slow and long, but 100%" and "faster, but <100%, and potentially a bit more expensive". So say you want to upgrade your gear. You have a quest that gives you the resources needed for the upgrade. Within the quest you must choose to either farm out 1k mobs (just for example) and definitely get the resource or you only need to farm 10 mobs but you get a "1%" resource. You can only choose one. And that "1%' resource doesn't have an ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-22 15:48:35
Yep, that's me and a dozen or so of my friends. Waiting for a great mmo, while trying to enjoy other games or replaying the same old mmos of yesteryear. And I agree with the previous post that Ashes has to have each of its components be fun, first and foremost. And if the game is fun, both sides of the pvx spectrum could somewhat ignore any features they dislike from the other side, mainly because their own side is super fun. Hope it works out that way. And on that hopeful note I'm going to sleep, cause I ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-23 00:47:07
One question though. Couldn't they just ask the healer? Like, I'm fighting the boss; the boss does some mechanic that brings me to low hp; I see that I'm at low hp and expect a heal; the heal doesn't come, I die and the raid wipes. I then ask the healer why the heal didn't come (assuming that I did everything correct and the boss mechanic wasn't avoidable at that particular moment). Healer just tells me that he was CCd. I played a solo healer for a 36member raid a few times back in L2. The mechanics themselves weren't ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-23 02:31:06
It is still a weaker "cheat" than the one you were talking about, but yes, I do find the required omniscience a bit silly. And then you have a closed loop of "the design requires me to know things that I can't know w/o a tracker and the tracker lets me know literally everything so the design should implement even more things that I wouldn't be able to know w/o the tracker". I feel like this kind of pve design is the same copout as L2's "just let the pvp be the difficult part" one.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-23 02:37:45
I still think that removing the ability to kill the PKer if you're in the same party/raid/guild/alliance would be a good addition, just to justify the BH system and make the "red gameplay" riskier. While the interaction itself is not an exploit, I do think it makes the red's life easier and, imo, more boring. You wanna live life on the edge - do so. Be hunted and try killing mobs while several BHs are on your ass. That seems like an amazing way to spend an evening to me.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-23 02:49:13
The issue to me is that if "make a drawer" is your goal, the tracker is the IKEA, because it gives you everything you need to figure out how to make that drawer. While "making it with what you have w/o any instructions" would be the non-tracker gameplay. You'll probably waste twice as much wood, if not more, but you'll do it with your own hands (while, yes, using multitude of tools) and figuring out what goes together the best and what doesn't. Making a drawer is a difficult process, but if you have an instruction/manual - it's way ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-23 03:02:52
Yes, and that game is more fun than just PKing someone when you need to and then your friend clearing your corruption immediately (that is if dying is the only valid way to remove corruption). And this would address the complaint of "group friends can PK freely and avoid the biggest penalty of the system". Obviously dying to your friends is still not really an exploit, because you're not avoiding the main penalty, but I agree that the gear drop part gets kinda weakened in that case. And as I said, this change would just make the system more ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-23 03:17:58
Literally says "flags only to corrupted players" https://ashesofcreation.wiki/Bounty_hunters So the green friends will have to go corrupted too. And yes, you can kill mobs to remove corruption, but we don't know the details about how much corruption it removes and whether it'd be just way faster to just die to a friend (which I addressed in my post). So removing the ability of your friends to kill you (that is if you're in a guild/raid/alliance together) would add a much bigger push to farm mobs instead. Alternatively you could die to a mob, if you have strong mobs near ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-23 03:31:13
It would be quite bold of Intrepid to completely shift from the currently promised system. And the fact that they've barely changed their systems/promises in the past 5 years leads people to be quite adamant in their belief in what the pvp system will be. Especially when you compound the absence of change in design direction with Steven's love for L2/AA, with L2 being the main inspiration for the pvp system.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-23 04:54:34
No, it's exactly because trackers push the content beyond reasonable design is what leading me to have issues with them. My main issue with the tools analogy is that trackers are an external tool, that give you omniscient information that you wouldn't have had otherwise. And that is why I related them to the manual of an IKEA drawer. The manual gives you all the information that relates to the "encounter" and then it's on you to figure out what and how to do in order to succeed at completing said encounter. You were not the one who made ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-23 05:13:08
Pretty much I'm all for superhumans winning over normal players. And I don't even consider myself one of such superhumans. I might get up to their skill lvl through endless repetition, while they'd be up there by default, but it's exactly because of that that I want every player to play their role as they would play it w/o omniscient knowledge of what and where to do. In other words, let gods be gods. If everyone is a god - no one is.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-23 07:55:05
But if the example I gave did in fact lead to a wipe mechanic, with the hint being the little feint that boss does w/o any audio cues - wouldn't that be a good "difficult" mechanic that still doesn't require you to have a tracker, but instead just pay attention? That's my whole point. I understand that you're so used to having trackers for your pve, but I'm giving you a directly opposite pov. To me, that kind of mechanic would be fair. The hint is still there, but you gotta notice it to use it. The fight didn't ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-23 08:24:42
You do realize that you just said "make mechanics only visible to those who use trackers", right? Me seeing what I need to do during the fight is the same as you reading the tracker that shows you the same thing, except your does so in unreasonable detail, while I can only infer whether what I saw is actually the hint for what I need to do. Again, that example was the very basic one. You could have misdirections, double or tripple triggered mechanics, ability pattern based mechanics (that would only show up if a particular string of abilities ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-23 08:29:15
I guess my approach is just different. I want to see that and then apply what I thought I saw in the next fight. And then the next and the next and so on, iterating on my gameplay until I win. But do all of that with just the info that I and my raidmates see, instead of what the omniscient tracker sees. Either way, we're back to running in circles w/o really changing anyone's mind. We comes from too different of a backgrounds to truly see each other's points. So I might as well just let Mag call ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-23 08:47:05
I think that's called "create a problem and sell the solution", except in a more consumer-friendly way, where instead of selling, the creator of the problem just gives you the solution Nah, I'm just too far on the other side of the spectrum. I don't see invisible mechanics as fun, nor invisible puzzles as interesting.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-08-23 08:55:28
I mean, if you are trying to appeal to the audience that will make and use them - yes. So the only thing remaining to be figured out is whether Intrepid is trying to do that. Which brings us back to the discussion of promises and alleged design choices And that's a neverending story until we see alpha2, at the very least.