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Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 04:38:57
And it should be a difficult part of the game. If you're just leaving your own guild with your main to spy on another guild, you're not spending more time to be worthy to get an invite to the guild you wanna spy on. Also, if you're even a bit of a good player, any enemy guild will know you by name. If you're a great player who also plays a lot (meaning invests a lot into your guild) - you will not only be known by name, but you might also be the main target for most guilds. ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 04:47:51
I mean, my suggestion is literally summoning things that are doing the Roguey tricks additionally to your own existence. That's as summoney as it gets. Right now what we know about Mage augments is the TP school and Elements, which means that Rogue/Mage will probably have some "blink behind you back"-type shit and/or firey dagger throws or icey smoke bombs. Or some liquid stealth runs that make people who you run by wet, which boosts electro dmg or makes it easier to freeze them.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 04:57:02
Also, now that I think about it, having literally your entire account feed off of one guild's benefits (w/o taking up as much space in the guild too) while committing only "one amount" of your time is way fucking easier and casual than having 5 alts in 5 different guilds that all consider you a valuable-enough player that they don't kick you. The argument so far has been "you can't be in multiple guilds on different alts because you're trying to make use of all those benefits", while BISH you're the one who's reaping way more benefits than you ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 05:06:31
The Rogue might/will have those abilities. The augments would only put additional effects on them or maybe change their function slightly (doubt even that).
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 05:11:06
Just to make sure there isn't some misunderstanding. I was talking about the OP's post, not your latest comment.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 05:15:00
Yep, both of those things are very close to what I'm imagining it's gonna be too. I hope it's some super cool interactions like I described, but I'm trying to reign in my imaginative mind, cause I know that I'll only get disappointed if I start thinking up all these cool and strong designs yet they'll never be in the game
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 05:24:07
From everything they've disclosed about the augment system so far, it's all been - "you do not get new abilities from your augments". You archetype gives you all the abilities you'll ever use and the augments only provide changes/additions to those abilities. So it's not like you'll just get a summon if you get a summoner secondary. You'll still only have your Rogue abilities which will then be somehow changed with Summoner augment schools, which we got 0 info about.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 05:35:00
I reaaaaally hope there's some of that interaction between mirror-like classes too. An X/Rogue has poison augments on their abilities, while a Rogue main could not level up active poison abilities and instead put all the points into the passive abilities that get boosted against poisoned targets. The true party gameplay and synergy.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 15:08:51
The whole point of the current flagging system is to prevent karma bombing. Aoes don't hit non-combatants. In order to hit a non-combatant you have to target them, hold down a button and then hit them. Same as it was in L2. You can't be karma bombed unless you decide to gain corruption. The only way a lowbie could "karma bomb" someone is if they'll be able to wear high lvl gear w/o any penalties (slow movement and such) and if the "power stat" icon on players have 0 indication of how high a player's lvl is (I sure ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 15:18:49
Ok, not casual. Lazy. Or whatever the best-fitting word is for a person who wants all the benefits for none the work. Lately that's been "casual". Yes, not all casuals are the same, but from everything I've seen on forums/reddit - "casual" is usually used for people who want all the rewards with the smallest amount of investment into the work required for the reward. And the suggestion of "all of my characters on one account benefit from being in the same guild w/o me spending x (the amount of characters on an account) times the time required to ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 15:31:56
Yes, aoes don't dmg non-combatants. And it's not an issue. It's intended design to avoid exactly the exploit you were trying to use to argue against Dygz.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 15:46:10
No you do not when it's fucking 6+ characters for just one place in the guild. You are not putting 6+ times the investment into the guild, yet you're getting 6+ times the benefit. That is not how that works when your alts can be in other guilds, because you'd have to work 6+ times as hard if you had 6+ alts in 6+ different guilds. BECAUSE EACH GUILD CAN KICK YOU IF YOU DON'T DO ENOUGH FOR THEM.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 15:49:35
It hasn't been mentioned because usually we like to assume that when someone suggests a change to the planned design, they know said design. This flagging system has been known since the very beginning afaik, because it was taken and improved from L2. And what kind of disadvantage would you be in? If you're flagging on a person - you've made the first hit, unless that person has already flagged against you. And any lowbie won't kill you with just one hit, just as you shouldn't be able to do the same to them, so no disadvantage there either. ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 16:01:22
If the content requires purely active players - you kick alts and/or make a sub-guild for them. If some of your members can use several pcs and commit as much time/resources as 2+ separate players (even in raids/mas pvp) - they deserve the guild spots. Exactly because they're working twice (or more) as hard as any other member. That is the whole point of alts being in the same guild - each character must earn their place because places are limited. And having alts take up spaces in an empty guild is not cheating, otherwise all mmos would prohibit ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 16:03:35
Nah, I misspoke, my bad. The only assumption here is "if you're talking about a mechanic - you can at least look up how it works". Especially when you blame someone else for not understanding said mechanic, like you did with Dygz. That's where the ego comes in.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 16:18:13
As someone who has been a GL for 200++-member guilds - it is not a mess. You either have all your members as mains, because you care about being at your top fighting potential at all times, or you don't care about that and let some alts in, kicking them as soon as there's a contender for that place. It is really not that hard. And I could do this back when I was not even 18, so I'm sure that an adult who has more inter-personal experience can manage that too. Especially considering that they were the ones ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 16:26:54
As I saw it, Dygz didn't even know what that phrase meant, which is why he didn't know what and how to explain. And unless I missed it, you didn't explain to him what you meant by it. I know of that phrase because I've heard about it from the BDO players and could reverse-logic it out from what was "flag bombing" in L2, but not everyone has that kind of experience/knowledge. Especially in the case of Dygz whose pvp experience is limited to event/goal-based things, which never have these kinds of interactions.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 16:31:12
Again though, make that an option. Just don't force shit on people. Forcing never works.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 17:29:40
It's also not a BDO karma system of +-. It's a binary system of "you're either corrupted (red) or not". And then if you are corrupted, there's the severity of penalty depending on how much corruption you have. So you don't decrease someone else's corruption, you increase it by dying to them w/o attacking them.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 17:38:49
I'm not sure what exactly you mean here.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 17:48:43
But what if I want to be different people with different people. Just as any person is different when they're with their coworkers compared to when they're with the family and/or friends and/or their other half. I want to be a tank for my main guild, but then a healer to another group of people and a dangerous PKing rogue to a third group of people. The one I just described. Some people call that the "role" part of the rpg in the mmorpg. And none of those benefits would influence other guilds. A competitive player wants to have ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 18:09:55
Ah, yes, if you continue killing non-combatants, you'll be in deeper shit.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 18:31:05
We could have it on a scaling system. You get blocked by a lot of people in general chat on one char? You get chat banned for a hew hours. You get blocked/reported by several people on your alt? A day chat ban account-wide. You keep doing this stupid shit after those bans? You get banned from the game for a day or two and get flagged to GMs in case you're still doing this shit later. Same thing could apply to PMs. You block one char and it's only a block on that one char. You block another ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 19:53:55
As long as all of that is optional, I'm fine with it.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 20:25:09
Yet that kind of espionage work is what makes the best stories coming out of EVE and the other games like it (though nothing is really like it). Obviously it's not meant to be fun for the side that suffers from those actions, but that's part of the design of the game. It's not trolling, it's strategic competitive actions against your enemy, that took a shitload of time and effort to execute. It wouldn't though. It adds nothing to the guild but dissolution of player roles. If instead of having a single true role you have 6 alternatives that ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 21:06:14
I think the issue there is that Mag thinks that you don't play a character that gets the benefits. You play as yourself, a player, that is somehow benefiting constantly from all those benefits from different guilds. Even though that is not the case at all.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 21:18:02
Nah, I'm completely the same way. Which is why I've been arguing against this suggestion this much. The "oh you just want all those benefits, and that's wrong" argument has been the main one so far, yet it makes 0 sense because you're not benefiting at all.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 21:59:30
That's the feeling I got from it? As in, "it falls onto the player to always contribute to the guild they've chosen, with any and all resources at their disposal", instead of "every guild is free to choose who's worthy of being their member and who's not". To me, as a GL, that just seems like a way to make life easier for GLs. Why worry that your members might be "cheating on you", when you can literally see all of the alts in your guild and know exactly when they're online. Why try to be the best GL ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-25 23:11:19
Good to know that ~20% of the posts I've seen in the last 2 years were purely in my imagination.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-06-26 00:19:47
Maybe my previous arguments didn't translate well? Or maybe I should've stated them more clearly. What I meant is, if you have 6 characters on an account and they all get the guild's benefits just for existing, and w/o taking up 6 slots in the guild - that's bad imo. As I've said multiple times before, if we operate under the normal rules of alt guild association - each alt would take up extra slots in the guild. Any competitive guild would then require you to put out as much action/resources/time investment as those taken slots would've provided were ...