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Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 15:01:29
And as I've demonstrated through videos before, L2 was animation-based and not gcd-based, so you were also locked in the animation while attacking and people could "dodge" your attack mid cast. The "dodge" action was different to an action game's, but the concept was the same. It's as if different games work differently
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 15:28:24
True, but how many of those does any given class have? Cause any class in L2 required this. You could've been aggroed by a tank and had to reclick your main target, you could've been clipped by a mage's aoe detargeting skill or by a dagger's targeted detargeting, or you could be hitting a light armor wearing class and it had an augment that made you lose their target at some % chance. All of those things usually meant that you gotta track your opponent constantly and you gotta be precise in your clicking, because if you spread out ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 15:44:59
In your quote about wow it literally says "animation is not important", but that is not the case in L2 because the damage is dealt at the end of the skill animation. And as was already shown before, L2 had a snap range on skills, so you could in fact prevent someone from hitting you by just moving out of the way. Now, L2's movement wasn't as fast as most action mmos and it didn't have all the iframe jumping around so it was difficult (almost impossible in most cases) to avoid hits by just moving, but it was ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 16:29:02
I haven't played too much BDO, but "pixel hunting" in smth like shooters (which would be close to pixel hunting in L2) was way harder than just moving my camera around in BDO. You're not hunting pixels in BDO, you're hunting a huge target and then use aoe most of the time on top of that, exactly because having action mmos be as hard as playing a sniper in CS would probably push way too many people away. If there are action mmos where most of your skills are just precise headshot-like abilities - I'd definitely like to at ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 16:53:41
Guess you either didn't read my answer to Stackerson or decided to dismiss it completely, but as I said there, in L2 you had to track your target because your targeting would be removed quite often. You also had to constantly move away from other people and any potential aoes (be they on the ground or around your allies or around enemies) and you did that with the same mouse that you used for targeting. So your eyes had to track your surroundings, your target's movement, your allies' movement and other enemies' movements - all while clicking on the ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 17:06:42
Darkfall definitely seems close to what I imagine when I think about difficult action combat. Though it looked fairly slow in the video, so I guess you could still get more hardcore. ESO didn't feel as precise though. Maybe it was just the class in the video or it just doesn't translate through video as well. Have you played all 3 (BDO being the 3rd)? Which one would you consider the most difficult one mechanically/aiming-wise?
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 17:18:13
I wish I recorded my pvp from back in the day, but sadly I didn't. And most videos I've seen on yt don't match the gameplay I, or my friends, had back then. Though I'm sure that even if I did have those videos, you'd just say that it's not the same because it doesn't look the same (which it wouldn't, because the video doesn't explain/show player action, only character action).
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 17:20:22
I'm curious, why do you often have this "H" at the start of your comments?
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 17:28:26
Yep, which is why I'm gonna be pushing for "target play" in the tab side. It would not only raise the skill ceiling, but would also help with the hybridness of the combat, cause it would either push people towards trying out action abilities or just get used to being more aware of their targeting than just clicking once and unloading everything w/o worry.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 17:43:32
Sadly not really. The more videos I watch, the more I think that I was either in a bubble within a bubble that had hardcorer players than the usual masses or that I'm just so deep in nostalgia that I'm completely misremembering how the combat truly was. The former is kinda untestable and the latter would take me several weeks of hardcore grinding on a new server to really figure out if I'm remembering my gameplay correctly. But I don't have the energy to grind L2 that much right now
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 19:16:37
https://forums.ashesofcreation.com/discussion/52825/to-steven-please-stop-using-godmode-during-showcases#latest
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 20:20:23
Your suggestion wouldn't discourage, it would remove griefing of lowbies. It's good in that aspect, but it completely defeats the goal of "risk vs reward" in Ashes. You want to kill a lvl20 dude as a lvl50 dude, for whatever reason? You can in the current system, but in yours you'd have to level up a lowbie of your own. Now, the chances are, people will do that either way, but your system doesn't stop lowbie alts from griefing other lowbies so it's not like you're solving this problem. And as Dygz said, Corrupted players are pretty much loot ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 20:33:01
I mean that just sounds like the enhancement system, where you can add elemental attributes to your items. That's not really class-specific stuff, but just a good general feature. Class-specific gear would be smth like "this item increases warrior's HugeAss hammer strike by 5% and gives it a chance to stun on crit" or smth along those lines. And as much as I would like that kind of gear, I'm not sure if it'd be good for balancing, and whether this kind of gear would work well with the crafting system.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 21:20:30
But with fewer views so you already know that this thread has all the regulars just arguing with each other, while the main feedback thread is just purely newer/non-regular people posting a comment or 2.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 21:32:33
*flags on you cause you're farming this thread*
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 21:44:34
Dygz definitely has already gone past his pvp limit for the day so he's green as hell. Everyone else shall be free food
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 21:47:16
Nah, you're flagged at best. You're not hardcore enough to be corrupted Azherae though. Now she's definitely the reddest here
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 22:21:26
That's already kinda the case because everyone can kill anyone from lvl1. Also the case. Green players drop a particular amount of gatherables and processed goods on death. And flagged people drop 50% of that amount on death. That's the case in a way. There'll be pvp seasons of different kinds, with some kind of rewards, so killing someone will give you "currency" that gets you that reward.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-05 22:35:56
Ah, so the same problem I have with this forum's draft saving system
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-06 18:18:06
I haven't played top lvl pve, but what I'm imagining when trying to roughly design some complex encounter is smth like "you gotta track ground hazards, several party memebers' positions and your relations to them, particular buffs on yourself and the boss - all while doing peak dps (or your own class' role), and all those mechanics being randomized instead of in the same order every try" for tab; and smth like "you need to aim at particular points on the boss, while dodging horizontal/diagonal/vertical attacks from mobs/hazards - ideally when the boss is not a hugeass stationary pillar ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-06 18:31:56
Support classes in L2 were the backbone of the whole party. Your party was nothing w/o them and couldn't do any dmg either. And usually supports took up 4-5/9 party spots. I'd assume their importance will be as big in Ashes too. And as Dygz said, they allegedly want to balance the game around all 8 archetypes. I hope it's in the way of some synergy abilities/passives where you need those archetypes in your party and your individuality and differences will come from gear builds and class/social augments.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-06 18:44:01
As Depraved (and I before this) has already said, this would not solve the issue of lowbies dying. The only thing you would influence is the number of alts on the server. Those who really want to PK others will always find a way to do so, and, more often than not, do so in the least detrimental way for them.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-06 18:58:35
Maybe this is where the misunderstanding stems from. I'm talking about peak pve content (I think Noaani is usually talking about this too). The content that Steven promised "only <10% of people on the server" would be able to do. And, imo, that content requires that kind of complexity and difficulty to be fun for the people who want that content, as Noaani has said muuultiple times (and now Azherae said the same thing). As for why so much dodging or why the boss gotta be different or why hit particular parts - imo, all those things represent what ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-06 19:21:04
I think you concentrated too much on the toxic part of that comment. Azherae was talking about the complexity of the encounter. And the complexity was so damn high that explaining it completely could be laughable. If there's 6-7 things that have to be tracked at the same time and those 6-7 things come from a pool of potential 20 things and the can have random triggers and order - you ain't explaining an encounter to a person. At best, you could explain what the things themselves are and what you need to do when they happen, but that ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-06 19:33:17
Yeah, I hope it doesn't devolve into "multiple windows: the game". I love L2 with all my heart, but running multiple instances of the game just so I can play it solo while I wait for my CP members to get online was a damn pain. Now, there's the argument of "you'll only need to farm in a party and you'll have all the other non-combat shit to do solo" which is fairly viable here, because in L2 you could only really farm mobs, while in Ashes you'll have a very wide variety of things to do. But for ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-06 19:42:22
That issue is already solved by corruption. A single kill of a lowbie would throw you deep into corruption, at which point you'll have to die multiple times, you'll go back hours if not days of XP grinding, you might destroy whatever gear you have on your through decay (depending on a few variables), you'll lose some gear due to it just dropping - and even if you manage to not die as a deep Red, you'll have your stats slashed in pvp so you won't be able to keep killing for much longer. Will a few lowbies on ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-06 20:13:42
And that is exactly why I said that you need to have a relatively smaller and nimbler bosses in action games. Exactly in order to utilize all those tools. Otherwise it's pointless. Having a huge stationary boss that you just unload onto is not difficult imo. Yes, there'd be hazards and some aoes to step out of, but that's literally the same as tab combat, so why not just have it as tab. And this is why I separated the boss encounters the way that I did. And why I hope that Intrepid can find a way to combine ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-06 20:34:57
I didn't address that because it's just an opinion. I personally like tab more. I like the feeling of control that more information gives me. I like piano playing on my keyboard and having utility skills that I can only use in particular situations. Action combat seems super dull to me because it's just dodging and spinning your camera around. Yes, it obviously takes skill, but I'm not interested in acquiring that skill because it doesn't arise any emotions in me. You disagree with me on this and that is completely fine, opinion is just that - an opinion. ...
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-06 20:37:12
I'd be very interested to learn about the fight, purely because it'd let me understand the pve pov better. I've got a ton of assumptions of my own, but I feel like some of them might be off base because I haven't really experienced any good mmo pve.
Post by Ludullu on 2022-07-06 21:05:10
So you want to prevent people from being free to attack anyone they want (with consequence) under the pretense of protecting lowbies, yet you're against direct in-system prevention of the same lowbies dying even more? That's a weird take.